Calling 3 bets with pp's

darbday · Dec 13,2010, 04:20 PM

Meaning to ask this for some time. Can't find a hand history to represent but when i get a pocket pair im looking for situations where i have 13 bbs implied odds. So say I'm in mp with 60 bbs and everyone has that. I raise 2.5 bbs and folds to button who re raises to 6 bbs. Am I now looking for 78 bbs (13 X 6bb)implied odds or 45bbs (13 x (6-2.5)).

Any thoughts on what kind off implied odds we need to do this with?

syphilaids · Dec 13,2010, 05:17 PM

um ok but who really re-raises to 6bbs? I'd say 8-9bbs minimum.
in theory, if I can afford to call, I think I can stack the guy, and we're both deep I'll set mine. I generally want 10-1 implied odds on my call.

Richard~ · Dec 13,2010, 05:57 PM

Well your 2,5BB's in the pot so you need 3,5 more to call. That's your new number, I setmine everytime if I have 20x that in my stack and all the way down to 12x that if I have reason to believe villain is really strong pre

darbday · Dec 13,2010, 06:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by syphilaids

um ok but who really re-raises to 6bbs? I'd say 8-9bbs minimum.
in theory, if I can afford to call, I think I can stack the guy, and we're both deep I'll set mine. I generally want 10-1 implied odds on my call.

micros players do anything and everything.

so its 10 to 1 on the 3bet size then correct....what you put in the pot plus what you have to call?

and then your happy with set minning or fold almost always?

i think i realized ive been calling these with 30-40bbs...way too little of a stack....didn't realize it would have to be 60bbs effective till i wrote this thread....

darbday · Dec 13,2010, 06:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Richard~

Well your 2,5BB's in the pot so you need 3,5 more to call. That's your new number, I setmine everytime if I have 20x that in my stack and all the way down to 12x that if I have reason to believe villain is really strong pre

the new number is 3.5 or 6? and if i read correctly if villain is strong pre...you feel you have better implied odds so you can have a smaller stack (12x) because he's more likely to stack off?

when i'm deeper i can play aggresively and get some folds without hitting a set but this low its hit a set or fold....just wondering if were happy with that knowing we have implied odds but only implied odds no real other lines....

thx..

Richard~ · Dec 14,2010, 01:14 AM

Think of it like callinga 3,5 BB open raise to setmine, factor in if you're in or out of position and how likely he is to have a big enough hand to stack off. Also if you opened adjust a little bit for the amount of money in the pot already which gives you slighter better immediate pot odds. (definition of implied odds is simply pot odds adjusted for betting on later streets so if you get really good pot odds pre you're not gonna need to win as much money post flop when you hit even though that's where almost all the value in pocket pairs lie)

Getting 3bet with pairs really isn't fun, especially deep in a tournament, we're rarely gonna have odds to set mine, villains range is rarely gonna be virgin tight and even if we think villains range is wide all we have to 4bet bluff are really just two low card blockers. I think that really shows again why adding in a little bit (not as much as some high stakes players, but just once in a while) air in your 3bet range will be effective since opponents will have a harder time setmining vs your 3bets and won't be able to defend against them as effectively

darbday · Dec 14,2010, 01:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Richard~

I think that really shows again why adding in a little bit (not as much as some high stakes players, but just once in a while) air in your 3bet range will be effective since opponents will have a harder time setmining vs your 3bets and won't be able to defend against them as effectively

thanks, i understood most of it already but i really needed a little bit of clarification, and i got it......