Ran into another situation on Friday at a live tourney.......the fabled K's vs. A's.
I'm not new to this in tourney play....I've had the K's about 10 times in live tourney's in this spot. Most of the time it's just a cold deck and lose or suck out. But on 2 occasions I can remember being quite sure my opponent held A's.....but of course I call anyway.
Here's my scenario on Friday:
16 players left, paying 10.....Blinds 1500 - 3000 no ante. Avg stack is maybe 30000.....I have just over 40000.
UTG with K's....raise to 9000........folds around to the buttom.
He's so tight he makes the girls jealous...and pushes all-in for slightly less than my total. Blinds fold.....I was going through his range of hands out loud. He's very easy to play against....would have cold called with Q's or less....the only hands I can put him on are K's or A's......being I had K's.....logic told me he had A's. Of course I call anyhow.......wtf.
Why can't I fold K's preflop here? Damn that pisses me off when you know, but you call anyway.
Ran into another situation on Friday at a live tourney.......the fabled K's vs. A's.
I'm not new to this in tourney play....I've had the K's about 10 times in live tourney's in this spot. Most of the time it's just a cold deck and lose or suck out. But on 2 occasions I can remember being quite sure my opponent held A's.....but of course I call anyway.
Here's my scenario on Friday:
16 players left, paying 10.....Blinds 1500 - 3000 no ante. Avg stack is maybe 30000.....I have just over 40000.
UTG with K's....raise to 9000........folds around to the buttom.
He's so tight he makes the girls jealous...and pushes all-in for slightly less than my total. Blinds fold.....I was going through his range of hands out loud. He's very easy to play against....would have cold called with Q's or less....the only hands I can put him on are K's or A's......being I had K's.....logic told me he had A's. Of course I call anyhow.......wtf.
Why can't I fold K's preflop here? Damn that pisses me off when you know, but you call anyway.
online, against tight player that don't raise much, it's a fold.
live, since the field is alot donkier, it make hard to fold good hands.
for tournment
you cannot make decision base on your hand and his range.
you have to take M, stack size,payout strutcher....
since you have less then M10,
if top 6 players get pay. I jam it here with KK all day.
top 9 players get pay. i'll have to see how many shortstack.
say 16 players left. 6 players with less then M2.
then i'll consider it bubble time, and try not to loose my entire stack.
online, against tight player that don't raise much, it's a fold.
live, since the field is alot donkier, it make hard to fold good hands.
.
I, on average do the opposite. Online I think I've never folded here preflop.....sometimes just calling raise if I suspect a big hand to see the flop. Live, I rely more on how players play, and my reads on them.
theres no way you fold KK in this spot, nobody is that tight where you put him on AA anytime he 3bet shoves.
I'll post another KK spot later tonight.
I play alot of lowball tourney live poker.....and I would beg to differ. Given, it is extremely rare when I can range a guy on that hand (ie. almost never)......but it can happen. I think about half the table assumed he had A's as well....so it wasn't just my average reading skills.
Again, I'll probably still call every time.....chug my beer and swear at the dealer for another cold deck.
While not a tourney, I did make someone fold his AA preflop in a cash game because he didn't want to loose all the money he made during the previous 5 hours. He refused to call my push for $700.
Back to the original post, I would never ever ever fold her preflop unless it was a satellite and top x got a seat or something. I have fold KK after a flop where I was A) sure I was behind or B) I had such a draw heavy board that one or the other was sure to get me.
I have never seen any player so tight all I could put him on was AA or KK.
__________________
Kristy, why can't we all just get along?
btw, I would never fold KK in this situation. This is one of the make or break spots to get you into the money.
Extremely tight and passive player.....usually limp with AK, or call a small raise unless he's short-stacked (didn't say he was a good player). 3 bet not in his vocabulary if he has a decent stack (unless he has the nuts of course).
Location: Milton, poker capital of the world.. after Wloo that is.
Posts: 9,242
Quote:
Originally Posted by AcidJoe
I have never seen any player so tight all I could put him on was AA or KK.
uhhh. Ahem....
And I've folded KK twice live (never online) both times in a cash game on 3rd raises preflop by tight players who are not short stacked. On both occasions I was shown to be right, although on one occasion a shorter stacked player called with middle suited cards I think and cracked the guys AA. He would have beat myself as well. I don't think I could do it in a normal tourney situation. I've probably ran my KK into AA several times before and maybe outdrawn the A's once.
Last edited by compuease; Sep 23,2008 at 09:06 PM.
Here is the scenario. 7 players left, top 3 get $12k seats, 4th gets $1k, 5th gets $560ish. Villian is pretty aggro, pretty much how he got his stack. What do you do here?
Hand #16312D93C5002559: WPT $12,000 FINAL!!
Seat 1: Vaak*** (492812.00 in chips)
Seat 3: damn*** (168282.00 in chips)
Seat 5: actyper (330029.00 in chips)
Seat 6: Igot*** (178140.00 in chips)
Seat 7: Sail*** (293384.00 in chips)
Seat 9: snoo*** (112766.00 in chips)
Seat 10: CORK*** (304587.00 in chips)
Vaak Klaas posts ante of $1,000
damn_u posts ante of $1,000
actyper posts ante of $1,000
Igotdanuts posts ante of $1,000
Sailboats posts ante of $1,000
snooker147 posts ante of $1,000
CORKYHOUSE posts ante of $1,000
Igot***: posts small blind $5,000
Sail***: posts big blind $10,000
Dealt to actyper [ Kd Kh ]
snoo***: folds
CORK***: folds
Vaak***: raises to $30,000
damn***: folds
actyper: raises to $80,000
Igot***: folds
Sail***: folds
Vaak***: is all in 461812.0000
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