thepok33

This is just a horrible ruling .. it aired last week WSOP Ep28 about 8min in Ep 28 - Main Event Poker Video by WSOP 2008 .. how has it never been picked up before, with all the hands that have been played in the WSOP ?

moose

Great 3rd post! Horrible decision.

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To Bet or not to Be(t). That is the question. - Billy (Big Slick) Shakespeare
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BADAPPLE67

I use that move sometimes, but usually I usually say "I guess I have to look you up" works well but its not nice.

800OVER

Brutal decision. I can't believe that even after asking for the floor the second time they still got it wrong. Push forward all your chips but don't let go and you can pull back as many as you want. At least if you're playing the wsop main event.

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We can all use some extra redundancy.

13CARDS

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Haddon's suggestion

schabs

That's terrible what a joke, then the russian guy has the sense to babble some swears in his language....

13CARDS

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Haddon's suggestion

ReefAquarium

How do you play the video's on the pokvid site?

I just go the the page and when I click on part1 nothing happens.

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Not smarter than a grade 5 or Kristy Sea

13CARDS

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Haddon's suggestion

Milo

For the record, I hate guys who will move a stack (in their grasp, as per 13Cards example) forward, and proceed to drop 4-5 chips. In the occasional home tourneys I run, that gets you a caution. It is not right, imo. And I think the ruling in this case, as made by the TD was ridiculous in the extreme. What Carroll said towards the end of the dispute is EXACTLY correct. By that ruling a player could move his whole stack in a push/pull motion as per Losev's action, and then toss in a single chip. Horrible.

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Bet all you want . . . just don't bet any you want back.

philliivey

if i was on that table i would have told everyone to stfu, as a viewer it was entertaining and i do agree it was a fooked ruling, but no need to carry on after the ruling has been made.

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Doing better on 27 man's.

ReefAquarium

Thanks, I got it working,

That was clearly the wrong ruling

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Not smarter than a grade 5 or Kristy Sea

ottawaplayer

The TD and ruling was focused on the fact that he had not released the chips from his grasp, therefore he was able to pull them back and make a bet. However, if this is accurate, then what Carroll said about his example should also hold true.

I do recall on some episode of Poker After Dark (I'm pretty sure that it was this show...) that after a raise, the other pro slid the calling amount forward but left a few fingers on the stack while he talked to his HU opponent. Until he released his fingers, it was not considered a call. Now, maybe this is different, since it was a call and not a bet, and also perhaps the pros on Poker After Dark get some variations on the formal rules.

Rocco

TERRIBLE ruling!

WTF is wrong with those floor personnell?!?

I was so happy to see that dude get busted out after he went all in -w- some crappy hand. He got what he deserved.

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BlondeFish

There is a lot of uninformed hysteria about this hand, especially Michael Carroll, who probably didn't bother reading the WSOP rules but kept babbling about "forward motion" when there is no such rule.

Here are the WSOP house rules at the Rio regarding string bets:
The dealer is responsible for calling a string bet. All players at the table are encouraged to assist in calling a string bet if a dealer fails to identify one. A string bet called by a player must be verified by a floor person.

In this case, the dealer did not deem it to be a string bet. Brandon Cantu and Carroll thought that forward motion constitutes a string bet and they called for the floor. The initial floor person talked about "cut and drop", i.e., a wager is not binding until the chips are actually released into the pot. The main WSOP TD, Jack Effel, also judged that the bet was not released into the pot. He then had a talk with Nikolay Losev after the hand. It's not an easy judgement call, but this is the same as what I would have done: unless there was evidence from the dealer or previous actions that the player was intentionally trying to angle-shoot and get a read off Cantu's reaction, I would rule that 1.5 million is the bet and warn the player not to do it again (under WSOP Rules #30 and #41).

In other words, I agree with the floor people Effel, K.F., "ColoradoSkiBum" and 13CARDS that it was not a string bet.

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