labeach2002

Hi I was just watching an episode of Poker After Dark. I think it was an "old timers" episode. The owner of the mayfair club was one of the players. Two of the players were discussing a rule they used to use at the Mayfair club and when they played home games. They would allow anyone to request a cut at any time. Has anyone ever heard of this rule being used today ? Do you think this is a good rule to put in place ?

labeach

zunni74

I like it as much as any other rule that's put into place to try to minimize the opportunity for someone capable of manipulating cards to do so...

Provided of course that it doesn't slow the game down significantly.

__________________
"...the monkey looks to make sure we are not playing limit at Brantford." - Redington

Milo

Who's to say that said cut could not be manipulated, as well? And how could it not slow the game down?

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I don't gamble . . . but I will bet.

zunni74

It would slow the game down however I suspect if it's used a 'bunch' the person who made the request would lose that priv. to call for a cut.

Basically it was used when they didn't trust someone who was dealing and thought they may have stacked the deck. This happened infrequently because of the high percentage of regulars who frequented this particular club.

As for how a cut could be manipulated.. deck is on table, cut card is removed and a cut is made by the player who requested the cut. Since he's not the dealer (or his suggested accomplice), can you explain how such a manipulation may be done?

__________________
"...the monkey looks to make sure we are not playing limit at Brantford." - Redington

labeach2002

The way it sounded when they were talking about it was that it wasnt used very often and only when they had reason to beleive someone was cheating. I'd think it would be rarely used and if you asked for a cut from an honest player it might not be recieved favorably. It does seem like it really opens up a good opportunity for angle shooting.

It would likely slow down the game a bit but not much.

Did anyone catch this episode, they had some interestings stories on how they used this rule to catch a few cheaters.

labeach

800OVER

I don't think this rule would cause too many problems if it was used judiciously. One thing though. Could the cards be cut "at any time" including after the flop? This wouldn't go over very well with the people I play with (me either to be honest). I'd probably lose it if someone cut the cards before the river and my opponent hit his 1 outer.

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We can all use some extra redundancy.

zunni74

You one of the 'natural order' kind of people?

__________________
"...the monkey looks to make sure we are not playing limit at Brantford." - Redington

Milo

Responding to the bolded section:

I have seen guys who can take a card and tell you if it is a court card or not, just by weight, 100% of the time. I have also seen people who can tell how many cards they pick up, by feel.
Working as a team you put big cards near the bottom, and cut deep to bring them into play, after bottom-dealing simialr cards to your partner. Do not think it likely, nor very practical, as the skills take years to develop, but can it be done? I would think so.

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I don't gamble . . . but I will bet.

labeach2002

As I understood it, the cards/deck could be cut at any time including after the flop. I think there would be a few people that might have a fit if someone asked to cut before the river.

DataMn

I think the rule was a good one (if used judiciously) for a number of reasons:

1) There were (are) definitely people that could set up a "cold deck" without players noticing. There are a number of stories out there of player/dealer teams setting up decks and taking large chip stacks.

2) If noone knows what the next card is going to be, then it is just as likely that the "one outer" would come up on the uncut deck as it would the cut deck.

To make it so that there is no collusion on the actual cut, if Player A and Player B are in a hand and a cut is requested, have it done by Player C outside of the hand.

People that complain that the "natural order" of the deck has been disturbed are crazy - anything that can prevent cheating is good, as long as it is used in a reasonable fashion.
You are the same people that ask for a wash of the deck because that will magically change the luck of the cards. Nothing peeves me off more than someone asking for a wash or a deck change when I am paying session fee at the casino. All of you "change of luck" f***ers can stay home.

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The other one plays one for a living.

zunni74

What

So you would rather have players that aren't chasing their 4 outers (and calling your raises) because JTclubs is their favourite hand?

You'd rather not have those people who are moving from seat to seat (posting each time and increasing the dead money in the pot) because this seat or that seat is lucky...

Aren't those players (luck-based) the players you end up getting paid off of rather than the player who only plays the top 12 hands and understands how to lay those hands down when they don't hit?

A deck change or a wash is a slight inconvienience but gives you valuable information about the type of player you have at the table...

__________________
"...the monkey looks to make sure we are not playing limit at Brantford." - Redington

DataMn

In my experience it's not the guy who is chasing his 4 outer that asks for the deck change - it's the guy is a nit who has had his aces cracked for the 3rd time. It doesn't matter that he didn't bet to protect his hand ("they all would have called anyways"). It's just that he should win EVERY TIME he has aces in the hole.

__________________
One of us hunts donkeys...
The other one plays one for a living.