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Nash says fold?

UnknownUnknown
in MTT Strategy
Is that crazy talk or is this a crazy call. I actually think stop and go ...but almost no matter how loose I put villain (reasonably) this was an ultra fold....


Poker Stars, $2.28 + $0.22 NL Hold'em Tournament, 1,500/3,000 Blinds, 300 Ante, 3 Players

SB: 147,259
JodaB. (BB): 20,651
BTN: 102,090

Pre-Flop: (5,400) 5clubnormal.gif 7clubnormal.gif dealt to JodaB. (BB)
BTN raises to 9,000, SB folds, JodaB.???

Comments

  • UnknownUnknown
    easily getting that in
  • Richard~Richard~
    I probably just get it in as well, you're so far behind them. If you can double up while putting a dent in the shorter of your opponents you suddenly have a more reasonable shot for 2nd. cEV wise this should be a bit negative tho
  • CerberusCerberus
    You're definitely behind, but the likelyhood of being uber dominated by something like an A5 or A7 type hand seems pretty slim to me. A lot of ways to catch up with this, so I think take a chance. Of course, this is the guy with no bankroll, so I could just be f'n with you to try get you into the same boat as me :)
  • betrthanphilbetrthanphil
    its prob pretty close....stop and go is worst option because hes never folding anyways....i mean its basically the same as shoving. If I think my 5-6bb stack can have fold equity against villains than I fold....If they will call any 2 then I prob get it in here.
  • MeistroMeistro
    fold, u cant find a better hand than 7 hi to go all in with?
  • UnknownUnknown
    Meistro wrote: »
    fold, u cant find a better hand than 7 hi to go all in with?

    sooooted 1 gapper with ~6 beibers tho
  • VekkedVekked
    wtf don't shove pre you spewtards. Just fold. Flatting and shoving good flops could be optimal if you know exactly what you're doing but I don't and 99% of people don't either.
  • VekkedVekked
    seriously tho, if we have 7 high and no fold equity and we're not getting >2:1, why are we jamming pre? you guys realize you need to get folds to shove light right?
  • UnknownUnknown
    Vekked wrote: »
    wtf don't shove pre you spewtards. Just fold. Flatting and shoving good flops could be optimal if you know exactly what you're doing but I don't and 99% of people don't either.
    haha fuk all you all haha...

    omg i cannot wrap my mind around this fold :-\
  • VekkedVekked
    We need like 41% to get it in here... let's give him a pretty F loose range for 3x'ing the button of 40%: 75s has 37% equity, seem close right? Not really, let's double his opening range to 80%, we still only have 40.5% which isn't enough. He has to be opening 83% to breakeven purely from a chips perspective, and with ICM he probably has to be opening toilet paper and socks and all sorts of stuff.
  • UnknownUnknown
    Vekked wrote: »
    We need like 41% to get it in here... let's give him a pretty F loose range for 3x'ing the button of 40%: 75s has 37% equity, seem close right? Not really, let's double his opening range to 80%, we still only have 40.5% which isn't enough. He has to be opening 83% to breakeven purely from a chips perspective, and with ICM he probably has to be opening toilet paper and socks and all sorts of stuff.
    yes for sure, when i went to look it up i was like theres no way i should fold but ya even with a redic shoving range its a clear fold....

    but nash will have me folding alot on button too, which won't be so right because of hitting the blinds, my main concern is the nitty big stacks will prob call me alot but will refuse to tango with each other until I'm gone....

    I guess my question is am i folding on the button ever? Cause most of the time nash will tell me to fold the button and the bb again no?
  • VekkedVekked
    probably jamming wider than usual on the button for sure, probably not any 2 given how big their stacks are compared to you, but nash is definitely correct in this spot given that it's not even close to +cEV to get it in here.
  • Richard~Richard~
    i thought ICM worked in the favor of us getting it in here, there chance of the big stack 3 betting light to pressure the small stack with us still in isn't very big and I assumed there was added value in running cards vs the smaller of the two
  • MeistroMeistro
    surely shoving blind the next hand is a better play than essentailly calling all in here. gap concept. except the gap concept is for when u have a hand. we have 7 high.
  • MeistroMeistro
    (not that I sanction shoving blind next hand, or even shoving weak low hands), although given stack sizes u will need to be more aggressive than you normally would in a 3 handed game
  • VekkedVekked
    Richard~ wrote: »
    i thought ICM worked in the favor of us getting it in here, there chance of the big stack 3 betting light to pressure the small stack with us still in isn't very big and I assumed there was added value in running cards vs the smaller of the two

    ICM never tells us to shove wider than we would without there being pay jumps (well, it might tell us to shove wider because it assumes other people are playing proper ICM ranges as well). And it never never never tells us to get it in for -cEV spots, that just makes no sense.
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