Pre-Flop - Mid Pocket Pair and the Reraise?

JohnithJohnith
in No Limit / Pot Limit Holdem
One situation i find myself in fairly often is im holding a decent pocket pair anywhere from 8,8 to JJ and i raise anywhere from 3x - 10x the big blind depending on position (this is 6 player cash games online). Then i get a reraise from a later player ... I know i should fear being completely dominated by a higher pocket pair... or the the other guy is holding two overcards (which wouldnt be too bad).

My question is would the better play be to reraise his reraise just to catch more validity on his hand? Or call and hope he completely misses the flop?

Any input would be appreciated, thanks!

Comments

  • GrahamGraham
    10x the big blind seems a little excessive IMO for a pre-flop raise with no raise on board. It makes it harder for you to get any information because now when you get reraised you are probably committed if you want to call. I typically raise those type hands in late position (one of last 2 to act before blinds), and call in any other position for the set mine.

    One thing I see Daniel Negreanu say quite a bit is try to keep the pot small so you are less likely to be playing for all your chips.
  • GrahamGraham
    Here is a good video that discusses from early position:

    YouTube - Middle Pocket Pairs, Early Position
  • JimmyHoJimmyHo
    you could always check and if you get raised, it cost you less than a re-raise to see the flop (better in early position). If no one bets, you get to see the flop for cheap and if you hit your trips, your hand is well disguised. If a couple over cards come, you can still get away from the hand for hardly nothing. A lot of players will disagree with this strategy but I am trying to double through a player, not make a few bucks at a time.

    In a cash game, a starting pair really only has good strength post-flop if you hit trips. I have checked AA-QQ in early position before and if I don't improve on the flop, I can get away from the hand if it is a dangerous board. I usually raise about 70% of the time with AA-QQ. Good to mix up your play. A couple of weeks ago I checked in early position with QQ, player raised to $7 (1/2 cash game), so I called. Flop came Q78, I checked (hoping for a continuation bet) and this player pushed for $100. Should have seen his reaction when I flipped over the trip queens. I would normally bet with this hand but this guy liked the continuation bet. Didn't expect the push.
  • actyperactyper
    Theres enough info in the other 6max threads that you can read about

    Anything above 4x raise is just -EV.

    Jah, why so tight 70% raise with the top 3 hands? Mixing up play is fine, but I don't think you should overvalue mixing up your play. Majority of players only remember the first few pots you play and you maintain that label for the rest of your session.
  • GTA PokerGTA Poker
    pokerJAH wrote: »
    you could always check and if you get raised, it cost you less than a re-raise to see the flop (better in early position). If no one bets, you get to see the flop for cheap and if you hit your trips, your hand is well disguised. If a couple over cards come, you can still get away from the hand for hardly nothing. A lot of players will disagree with this strategy but I am trying to double through a player, not make a few bucks at a time.

    In a cash game, a starting pair really only has good strength post-flop if you hit trips. I have checked AA-QQ in early position before and if I don't improve on the flop, I can get away from the hand if it is a dangerous board. I usually raise about 70% of the time with AA-QQ. Good to mix up your play. A couple of weeks ago I checked in early position with QQ, player raised to $7 (1/2 cash game), so I called. Flop came Q78, I checked (hoping for a continuation bet) and this player pushed for $100. Should have seen his reaction when I flipped over the trip queens. I would normally bet with this hand but this guy liked the continuation bet. Didn't expect the push.

    This isn't really mixing-up your play, it's playing tight-weak poker.
  • GTA PokerGTA Poker
    Graham wrote: »
    Here is a good video that discusses from early position:

    YouTube - Middle Pocket Pairs, Early Position

    Quoting Dutch Boyd and now one of the worst self-proclaimed pro poker players to ever play the game -- I think Graham needs to retool his game.
  • JimmyHoJimmyHo
    actyper wrote: »
    Theres enough info in the other 6max threads that you can read about

    Anything above 4x raise is just -EV.

    Jah, why so tight 70% raise with the top 3 hands? Mixing up play is fine, but I don't think you should overvalue mixing up your play. Majority of players only remember the first few pots you play and you maintain that label for the rest of your session.

    In early position, still have the option to re-raise depending on the player.
  • GrahamGraham
    GTA Poker wrote: »
    Quoting Dutch Boyd and now one of the worst self-proclaimed pro poker players to ever play the game -- I think Graham needs to retool his game.

    Dutch Boyd is hilarious...

    YouTube - Dutch Boyd

    How about instead of just trolling you try and post something useful, like why you disagree with something in the video or what you suggest to do that is better?
  • cadillaccadillac
    does that green bottle have pee in it?
  • GTA PokerGTA Poker
    haha dutch boyd is great if you like scumbag, angle-shooting, cheating/robbing players...i have no idea how that guy was never stabbed given the number of people he ripped-off
  • BumbaclatBumbaclat
    pokerJAH wrote: »
    A couple of weeks ago I checked in early position with QQ, player raised to $7 (1/2 cash game), so I called. Flop came Q78, I checked (hoping for a continuation bet) and this player pushed for $100.

    what kind of fool makes a play like this? pushing $100 into a pot of $14-$17? Even if he has AA he is turning his hand into a bluff. crikey.
  • JimmyHoJimmyHo
    Bumbaclat wrote: »
    what kind of fool makes a play like this? pushing $100 into a pot of $14-$17? Even if he has AA he is turning his hand into a bluff. crikey.

    there were probably a couple more players in the hand pre-flop. Still a very bad push, agreed.
  • waderwader
    pokerJAH wrote: »
    you could always check and if you get raised, it cost you less than a re-raise to see the flop (better in early position). If no one bets, you get to see the flop for cheap and if you hit your trips, your hand is well disguised. If a couple over cards come, you can still get away from the hand for hardly nothing. A lot of players will disagree with this strategy but I am trying to double through a player, not make a few bucks at a time.

    In a cash game, a starting pair really only has good strength post-flop if you hit trips. I have checked AA-QQ in early position before and if I don't improve on the flop, I can get away from the hand if it is a dangerous board. I usually raise about 70% of the time with AA-QQ. Good to mix up your play. A couple of weeks ago I checked in early position with QQ, player raised to $7 (1/2 cash game), so I called. Flop came Q78, I checked (hoping for a continuation bet) and this player pushed for $100. Should have seen his reaction when I flipped over the trip queens. I would normally bet with this hand but this guy liked the continuation bet. Didn't expect the push.


    Is this 6-max?
    If it is...this is very weak.
  • JimmyHoJimmyHo
    wader wrote: »
    Is this 6-max?
    If it is...this is very weak.

    nope, full table.
    I personally like raising 70% of the time. If you prefer to raise 100% of the time, its a personal choice. Its really situational.
  • waderwader
    Agreed
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