$1 / $3 Cash game hand at Niagara
Everyone is fairly deep stacked, between $300 - $400 each
Sitting in the BB with T-T - UTG+2 raises to $16 - there was a straddle to $6 - mid position calls, folds to BB who also calls, straddle folds.
Flop is Q - T - 3 rainbow - original raiser leads out for $20, mid position calls -
BB ?
Sitting in the BB with T-T - UTG+2 raises to $16 - there was a straddle to $6 - mid position calls, folds to BB who also calls, straddle folds.
Flop is Q - T - 3 rainbow - original raiser leads out for $20, mid position calls -
BB ?
Comments
Keep in mind that I'm one of the worst NL holdem players on the planet though.
spread that wisdom comp
Better to take down a 100 dollar pot than lose your stack because some ding dong got the right price to draw to his straight.
About me being the worst NL player on the planet? I think it's already spread pretty wide..
you have experience on your side
experience ? He just old .
Comp.... You’re so old, when you were young, rainbows were black and white.
You’re so old, the movie “Jurassic Park” brought back memories.
You’re so old, you went to an antique auction and three people bid on you.
Your so old you bought your first car from Fred Flintstones.
Sorry for the derail DJ but I think you got your answer..
I think if you re-raise flop your winning a small pot when you could take a larger pot on further streets and if you build a pot on the flop, you are going to lead the turn regardless and then do what if you get re-raised on the turn? Check call if a safe card and maybe lead river for value.
Just my .02
So what do you do when the A or 8 hits, check/fold?
Isn't this what you want, to get stacks in as a close to 3-1 fav?
She just flatted the flop, turn was an 8 and mid position caller had J-9, one of two hands that beats her. (Q-Q being the other and less likely) and she lost her stack.
As others have said, raising the flop is an option but in my opinion, and knowing the mid position player, I don't think they fold to a raise on the flop. And the original raiser had A-Q and he called all the way down as well with TPTK.
Re-raising that flop kills a ton of your value, like the older lady did with her KK. Her overbet got AK to fold and the 16-outer to call. I also like flatting here as it disguises your hand more, giving you better value on future streets.
As played, I thought her only mistake was open-shoving the river. At this point she's only getting called by a better hands and is folding out almost all lesser hands. She also takes the shove away from from busted draws, AQ, and any 2-pair hands that may be out there.
Until then, she had kept the AQ in the hand, but got turned by the J9. I also think it's bugging her more because of who won the hand than how she played it.
I think that the results do matter a lot. It is the results that allow us to evaluate the play and break down potential leaks and spots to improve IF there are any.
So let me put it this way, that exact scenario is why I say calling is the best option.
If your on the flop and you got mid set you have the second nuts on the board. Cbet is common but also could have the hands as described AK AQ AJ A10 AA Kk less likely QQ JJ all the way to under pairs. The mid position is most likely a weak top pair or drawing hand. If both players are on a drawing hand they take each other's outs and your even further ahead. If they have any single paired hands over pair even bottom set your getting paid. So if you reraise you fold out all weak hands that give value on future streets when the board bricks out the draw and the river you go for value and they cry call. Mid position folds.
If you reraise there then the mistake is on the mid position if they flat call as they are giving away hiuuuge value. If you flat and then get in a spot where mod position jams on turn after a feeler bet you need to be able to fold this as there are very few bluffs here and it's all nutted. Now let's say Nicole checked the turn utg2 checks mid position bets out with the nuts and Nicole jams that is horrible as well because very very very thin value and most times called by better.
So I check call flop. Check turn evaluate if it checks through or call behind one more time with the 9 and check river to see. By checking you keep bluffs in and can decide on the river to go for value or just call and save your stack. If you check river and mid position jams due to size of the pot you need to be able to fold. And I say need to be able to fold if your going to just flat the flop.
If you are in a spot like what happened and you are playing in to the river and willing to call off a stack to a jam then it was played horrible because your allowing the player so much equity and implied odds by coming along even with a raise cuz they have position. So if you are willing to get all the chops in the middle, my suggestion would be to check the flop and jam on a flop bet. You now give them very little equity to draw out on you and they must decide if their outs and the size of the pot is worth it. Most times you will take it down there, other times your going to stack them when they call instead of allowing them to see a cheap turn and fold when they miss. And sometimes they are going to pay to draw and they hit. They were -ev to make that call in the position you out them in. Not to mention what if AQ calls behind your jam and mid position now feels forced to fold.
Anyways that is just my .02 but you need to evaluate the results to find the leaks and spots to improve.
Btw welcome to the dark side Glen.
I learned some stuff reading these replies.
Just remember doing the same thing all the time gets old so mix it up once in a while and have fun.
Probably lean towards raising given that there are two opponents and I have crap a lot there... but I'd think it's close enough to be fine either way. Maybe just adjust based on table dynamic... ie raise more when I have an image that looks like I'm out of line (never happens!) and call more when one of the two opponents seems that way.
Alex holy shit welcome back!
edit... disclaimer: I am probably the third worst player, after comp and DJ
Fair enough, just using it as a fire starter then
Thank you, glad to be back, missed a bunch of these crazy people so my hiatus has ended, that and I have let go of reasons which kept me away lol.
P.s. It takes a strong man to hold everyone up from the bottom and seeing as im the biggest, ill take the title of worst player
IMO, pretty big difference if the effective stack is 300 or 400. If it's 300, a CR to 70~ will leave you a PSB on the turn with 1 caller. Where as 400 will leave you a slightly more awkward stack to jam the turn.
I don't mind flatting if you had position, but OOP I rather take the betting lead.
I'm raising here. Your job is to get stacks in. Low limit players don't bluff enough. Lots of players playing broadway hands hit this flop.
Not raising is a huge blunder.
Your logic contradicts itself from the beginning.
If the quality of play is bad, put more chips in when our equity is ahead.
In other words, if mistakes are common because our opponents are bad - give them opportunities to make those mistakes. Calling and giving a card is not inducing a mistake.